♪♪
-Hello, I'm your host, Brian Callanan.
Police recruiting numbers have taken a turn
towards the positive for Seattle,
but that news is tempered
by several discrimination lawsuits
now facing the SPD
and a lack of progress on hiring female officers.
Plus, Seattle is rolling out a new system
of automated traffic cameras.
But where will they be installed
and how will they make Seattle safer?
I'm with Seattle City Council members Bob Kettle and Rob Saka
to discuss these topics
and the questions you're sending in too,
next, on "City Inside/Out -- Council Edition."
-My job is not to be a cheerleader
for the Seattle Police Department.
I am supportive, and they know that.
But I'm not a cheerleader.
-We need to slow people down, and this camera legislation
allows us to do exactly that.
-All that and more, coming up next
on "City Inside/Out -- Council Edition."
♪♪
Hello, once again, and welcome
to "City Inside/Out -- Council Edition."
Brian Callanan here with you
and, joining me this month on Seattle Channel,
I have Councilmember Rob Saka,
who represents District 1,
from Pioneer Square out to West Seattle.
He's also the council's transportation committee chair.
Welcome, Councilmember Saka. -Thank you, Brian.
Excited to be here today. -All right. I am too.
Also with us, Councilmember Bob Kettle,
Seattle's District 7 representative,
from downtown, out to Magnolia.
He's also the council's public safety committee chair.
Good to see you, Councilmember Kettle.
-Thank you, Brian. I really appreciate the opportunity.
-Let's jump in here. I want to start with an issue
that I know is top of mind for you, Councilmember Saka --
gun violence in your district.
Near where you live, there have been
a number of incidents over the past couple of months.
A 17-year-old shot at Roxhill Park in West Seattle.
There was a 15-year-old arrested as the shooter
in another incident.
And yet another situation
where more than 100 rounds were fired
at a vigil service near Delridge Way.
You organized a public safety forum
to talk with people in West Seattle about this,
many of whom are saying things like this --
"It's shocking how things are deteriorating around us.
Crime numbers may not be rising,
but the depressing feeling of our city
is on full display all over West Seattle.
It is not normal to wake up every day
to read about gunfire."
What's your message on gun violence
to the people of District 1?
-Yeah, my message is pretty simple.
I know you are fed up with the rampant gun violence, gunfire,
and, unfortunately, we're suffering from
a gun violence crisis across the city.
But the hotspots, when you look on a map,
it's not shared equally,
even in my own district, even in District 1.
People are fed up. I am too.
I happen to live close by where there's regular gunshots
in and around the Delridge, Snake Hill, High Point area.
-Yeah. -And I want you all to know...
...your city is taking action.
My office is leading investments, already,
in infrastructure, in safety improvements.
Plenty, plenty more work to do.
But I want you to know there's a lot of people in the city,
my councilmember colleagues and the Mayor's Office,
who are committed to doing better.
-Is there something that people would see on the street,
or is there something tangible you can point to?
People are always wanting that, I know,
when we have this discussion. -Absolutely. Absolutely.
So, there's a lot of tangible investments
I can point to concretely, definitively.
My office has, for example,
led an effort to double the amount
of new sidewalk investments across the city.
And through the support of my councilmember colleagues
and voters' approval,
we did exactly that -- $120 million
of new sidewalk investments.
On top of that, in those specific three neighborhoods
that I mentioned earlier,
my office has personally secured funding
as part of that $120 million plus
to construct 10 blocks of new sidewalks
in and around those three neighborhoods --
including, by the way, right in front of --
two blocks of missing sidewalks
in front of the Disabled American Veterans.
-And just make that public safety connection, though.
I think that's what I really wanted to focus on.
How are you investing in public safety, too?
-Yeah, in so many ways.
Uh, one of the incidents that you mentioned,
120 plus gunshots in and around the Delridge area,
that actually -- SPD informs us
that actually happened in connection with a vigil
for someone who was tragically murdered
earlier in the morning at one of these
previously-unregulated, un-permitted,
after- hours nightlife establishments.
-We'll get to that in just a second. Keep going.
-We're continuing to make progress on officer hiring.
I'm happy to talk more about that later.
But we, this council, in partnership,
in collaboration with this mayor,
we have passed at least 15 public safety bills.
I don't want to steal the thunder
from my esteemed colleague here,
the chair of the Public Safety Committee.
-Yeah. -Uh, but we are doing a lot
that for me, personally,
public safety has always been my top priority and top focus
and will continue to be.
It's going to take a while to reverse some of the things
that we've seen over time.
But we're making solid initial progress.
Plenty more work to do, of course.
-Okay. Thank you for that.
Councilmember Kettle, let's get into this.
Gun violence, of course, is a citywide problem.
And let's talk about this recent late-night lounge ordinance
you sponsored the council passed
that speaks to this issue.
Shootings have been an ongoing concern
around these locations that stay open after 2 am.
So the new law requires those lounges to have security guards,
video surveillance, more of an open door to police officers.
How is this ordinance going to make an impact,
and how is it different from past proposals
that focused on these issues?
-You know, one of the things is putting it in context.
And to follow up on Councilmember Saka's answer,
It's about pressing, you know?
There's the auditor's report,
but, really, it's about pressing
and using our strategic framework plan
'cause we're hitting this gun violence piece
and violence, generally, and the crime
by -- not just with the after-hours bill,
but also with street racing bill.
You know, trying -- SPD staffing is key.
So we've been doing that as well.
So it's about a comprehensive approach
to really put pressure and keep the press on
in terms of these public safety challenges we face.
Now, to the after-hours.
It really -- again, it shows
that we're not going to allow this
to be permitted anymore.
'Cause, too often, you said more access.
No, SPD does have access to those under this law.
And it's about regulating this area,
which was kind of falling in a gray zone.
It's about shrinking those gray zones.
I mean, this didn't apply to restaurants
and some other businesses,
but it applied to these that were a problem,
not just in the building itself, but in the neighborhood,
the nearby parking lots and the like.
And so, it's about us saying, this matters to us,
and we're going to address it.
-And it's a little more focused than what was in the past?
-It was more focused on the business side.
-Okay. -And this goes to this gray zone
that wasn't taken care of on the --
It's a public safety bill,
but it's got more of a --
This is the reason why FAS,
Finance and Administrative Services,
was key in this bill --
because it has that business regulation piece.
And that was the focus that --
that combination with the fact that
these neighborhoods are hurting,
not just in D1, but in D2, D3,
and they're hurting, and they needed action.
And that took away any, you know, resistance
or anything like that,
because the bottom line is,
we need to create safe neighborhoods.
And that's what we're doing with this bill that you mentioned,
the after-hours bill, but also all the other 16,
plus a resolution that we've done
in public safety out of this council, um,
because it's about putting that press,
using that strategic framework plan.
-Thanks. Let's move on to police hiring.
And I'll start with you on this, if I could.
Of course, it's been lagging over the past several years
in Seattle, around the country, even before the pandemic.
But the council has passed several measures
to improve recruiting
and has made Seattle police officers
the highest paid officers in the state.
That has led to a turnaround, as Chief Shon Barnes explained
in a press conference just a few weeks ago.
-We're on pace to hire more police officers this year
than any other time in our department's history,
illustrating the city's renewed commitment to public safety
and to community engagement.
-Councilmember Kettle,
Seattle has hired 60 officers this year,
compared to 10 last year at this time.
But I do want to put this in perspective.
The SPD is also facing several lawsuits from officers,
who say they've been discriminated against,
based on race and gender.
The SPD's goal to hire more women
is coming up short, too.
I just wanted to put these hiring numbers in focus here.
They sound positive, but is SPD building back better?
-Yes, I think we are building back better.
And part of this is the oversight
that the council's doing,
in terms of our responsibilities,
but also setting up
our accountability partners for success.
And so, like, we just introduced legislation
to help Office of Police Accountability
be able to do their jobs
with our Chief of Police investigation ordinance.
So, this is about showing leadership.
You know, Brian, I actually saw
an interview with you on this topic,
and you brought up leadership.
Most people don't, because we have bills
out of Public Safety on this issue.
We have some bills out of Council President Nelson's
Governance Accountability Committee.
And we also have the labor agreement
that came out of our Labor Committee, basically.
That's all great,
but you know what's key is leadership,
because the officers and the men and women of the SPD
know that we're not part of the chain of command,
but we're part of upper management,
and we're showing leadership.
And it's not just what we're doing on the dais.
It's all of us going to the precincts and saying, hey,
this is what we need.
We support you.
This is where our expectations are.
Oh, by the way, I believe accountability is important.
When you're the best force because of all the reforms
under the Consent Decree,
you should be embracing accountability
'cause you're that great.
But we need to build on it.
And one of the things is to --
That combination really makes it a more attractive place to be.
It's the combination of the bills,
but also the leadership piece.
And I just wanted to note that, because, in fact,
you did one time. -It's important to talk about.
And quickly on that Consent Decree,
it looks like we're closer to the end of that,
that federal oversight over the SPD
that's been in place since 2012
with regard to how officers dealt with suspects, et cetera,
and excessive use of force.
how close are we? Do you have any inkling on that?
I know it's a federal judge's call, but...
-We are now on the judge's, Judge Robart's, schedule,
because what we've done with our less-lethal weapons bill,
that was key.
And then we also had the resolution.
But the less-lethal weapons bill was -- was --
very important. -That needed to happen, yeah.
-That needed to happen.
And then the City Attorney's Office,
they filed the different briefs and information
to the court.
So, that has all happened.
So, now it's just a question of the judge's calendar.
And so it could happen tomorrow
or it could happen three months from now.
I don't have --
But everything that we need to do has been done.
So, now it's the question of the court system.
-I'll just say, quickly... -Please.
-...there were two key legislative developments
that needed to happen in order for us
to ever have the possibility
of potentially exiting from the Consent Decree.
Uh, Chair Kettle --
The Public Safety Committee, as Chair Kettle noted,
the less-lethal weapons legislation --
critical precondition for a possible removal.
That needed to happen.
And then my public safety resolution,
it did a lot of things --
honored and respected all first responders,
called for -- reaffirmed our commitment for a diversified,
balanced approach to public safety.
It also requested that the city Attorney's Office
file a motion to -- requesting that Seattle
get removed from the Consent Decree, among other things.
And so, those two key bills were essential.
So, we'll stay tuned.
It's really, as Chair Kettle noted,
at the judge's discretion at this point.
-Can I talk a little bit about --
I believe, in that resolution, too,
it was part of it that said,
uh, you wanted to reverse any prior commitments or pledges
to defund or abolish SPD services or personnel.
the City Council, in 2020,
did not formally vote to defund the police,
but several council members did make a pledge to do so.
This fact was brought up by many officers
who left the department here.
The defund issue, I know, stirs up
a lot of opinions and emotions here,
but I had a pragmatic question on this one.
When the time comes, when you have to make,
let's just say, a really tough budget decision
about paying for more police officers
or how much they're paid,
does a resolution like this put the council in the corner?
You know, in terms of how you have to pay them?
how do you look at that?
-My priority --
It's no secret that we are facing
a, I think, 240 plus million budget deficit this year.
Our projections are coming much slower.
Our revenues received are coming much lower
than was initially projected.
-Right. -Um,
I ran hard on the campaign
of promoting and advancing and improving public safety,
and police officers are a central component
of that strategy to make sure
we have safer streets and neighborhoods for all.
Now, I'm not going to hang our hat on hiring more police
and then slap each other high fives
and say attaboys, and think that's the end-all, be-all.
No, we need more police.
We also know we need more firefighters, too,
because, by the way,
our firefighter and paramedic capability
is not where it needs to be today, as well.
And the new CARE department our crisis CARE department,
we need compassionate responses as well.
That's why we have three co-equal chiefs in our city.
So, I'm committed to prioritizing funding
for all of those.
Uh, with respect to the Seattle Police Department,
they are -- we've made great progress,
as we talked about,
with respect to officer hiring,
but the numbers are still woefully behind
where I think the public expects.
-Okay. -So, I am committed, personally,
to working collaboratively with my colleagues, the Mayor,
to restore officer staffing levels
as we rebuild and reform the department.
-You wanted to say something here?
-I just wanted to add, well, two things.
One is it's interesting 'cause the, um --
our resolution was drafted
by a team led by Councilmember Saka.
So important.
And it's interesting 'cause it's, like, six pages.
There's only two sentences approximately on --
-I know. The defund thing jumped out at me.
-But it's really important.
Um, from what he just said,
all the other things about SPD, the reform and fire
and alternative response with CARE.
That's all there, too.
And that's important for the judge to see.
But the defund pledge point is super important.
And I say pledge purposely, by the way,
'cause it goes to showing leadership.
And I don't consider that an issue
'cause the second point I want to make is
my job is not to be a cheerleader
for the Seattle Police Department.
I am supportive, and they know that.
But I'm not a cheerleader.
I cheerlead for Seattle.
I cheerlead for my district.
My job is to provide oversight, is to be supportive,
but then do that oversight,
the accountability pieces and the like.
And that's important. And they're all professionals.
And I think they get it.
And that defund pledge, we worked together on it.
I supported that as well. And that makes a big difference.
-Okay. Thank you. -And we can quibble.
Can I just quickly -- We can quibble about, like,
the impact of Defund, and did they actually do it
or did they pledge and commit?
I knocked on over 20,000 doors to get to where I am today.
And there's nothing you can write on a paper
or in an online post somewhere
to say otherwise, to change the hearts and minds
of people across my district and across the city.
They were -- They defunded it.
And then on top of that, as you noted,
officers cited that routinely in their exit surveys.
And we lost the first black female police chief,
Carmen Best, the city has ever had,
in part because of Defund.
So I, uh -- We honed in on one specific feature of it,
which I understand, but that resolution was all-encompassing.
-It has a lot more to it.
Thank you for jumping into that with me.
-More depth, more breadth. -Absolutely, absolutely.
And Councilmember Saka, I do want to shift gears,
talk about what's happening with automated cameras in Seattle.
Council just passed this measure you sponsored
to add more speed zone cameras in places like parks,
construction zones, et cetera.
there were also several going in your district, in District 1.
A few questions from our viewers on this first. Here we go.
"Why is Councilmember Saka so focused on Alki Avenue
for automated speed enforcement,
When 35th Ave Southwest, Delridge Way, and California
all see much more traffic
and are a greater threat to human safety?"
There's another one -- "I am concerned
that traffic cameras will generate a backlash
if they issue expensive tickets for minor infractions,
like going less than 15 mph over the speed limit.
For less serious traffic violations,
Why not issue a warning the first time
a driver is caught by camera,
then a ticket the second time?"
I got a ton of questions on this one.
I picked out two of them.
"Can these cameras issue warnings?
Why did you want them in the areas you asked for
in West Seattle?" -Yeah, so, under --
So, this is an expansive program.
What we did was we passed legislation to align city code
with recent changes to state law.
And so, I have been a vocal advocate for cameras
and to be deployed in very, very specific locations
across District 1 -- namely, Alki and Harbor Avenue.
-To try to cut back on street racing?
-Street racing. There's problem street racing that occurs there.
People speed all over West Seattle,
all over District 1, and all over the city.
We've seen some egregious and infamous examples
of the Belltown Hellcat guy.
Parks across our city
are suffering from similar challenges
as the case in Alki and Harbor Avenue today.
I would support the department's exploration --
So, under the recent changes to state law,
it has to be a very purely data-based approach.
There are some exceptions that allow for parks,
including Alki and Harbor Avenue.
But, uh, so, on 35th Avenue,
yes, people drive too fast there.
We need to slow people down.
And this camera legislation allows us to do exactly that.
It's a proven federal and national
and international countermeasure
to slow people down on the roads.
And we know with respect to our own deployment here
in the city of Seattle,
when those cameras are deployed,
it directly results in a 71% decline
in traffic collisions. -That's a big deal.
I want to make sure I bring in Councilmember Kettle here.
There's an important wrinkle here
in that SPD employees, not sworn officers,
will be able to assess these camera infractions
and issue tickets.
This was not the case a couple years ago.
The city had a backlog
of millions of dollars of ticket money
that it wasn't able to recover.
You're aware of that. I am too.
Kyle had a question about this that I thought
had an interesting crossover into public safety.
It goes like this -- "What role do you believe
law enforcement should play in traffic safety
and how should that role be measured, evaluated,
and subject to accountability?"
Some thoughts here about these automated cameras?
-Well, there's the cameras piece,
and I support that change.
But then there's also the broader piece.
When I was in the community in Queen Anne,
each year I would have a traffic safety meeting with SPD,
and then I would have pedestrian safety with SDOT,
and the traffic enforcement piece is large, in SPD itself,
but also with the Parking Enforcement Office, too,
that team, as well.
And part of this is showing --
And this goes to a recent survey done by the Chamber,
the index survey.
They said, hey, they want government that works,
that takes care of business.
And this is an area that we can show
that we're taking care of business.
We're doing things right,
we're getting the basics done,
and we're showing a functional government.
And this is another example of that saying, hey,
this is really important.
This is like, hey, how can we show
that government is getting the job done?
And this is an example of it. -Thank you.
I want to move on to a question about ethics.
The Council, right now, is considering
a change in the rules,
such that councilmembers could vote on issues,
where they might have a financial interest.
There have been some high-emotion meetings
on this recently.
Currently, councilmembers recuse themselves in these cases,
but under the new proposal,
which was brought up by Ethics and Elections
for the sake of not cutting councilmembers out
of important votes.
Councilmembers would just have to disclose
that they might have a financial interest.
Here's a question that came in from a viewer about this.
"With the ethics rule change proposal,
how can Seattle residents ensure that their city council
doesn't become a tool of the rich and powerful,
as we watch the federal government
be taken over and dismantled by Trump and his administration?
Councilmember Kettle, can I start with you on this one?
-I think, well, for one,
I'm going to be meeting with the Commission, the Chair,
also the Executive Director, Mr. Barnett.
-Yeah, of Ethics and Elections. Keep going.
-Yes, and our central staff,
you know, our Legislative Council, as well,
to go through the different pieces.
And it's really important to do so
because, as I said on the dais,
I do have concerns and questions.
And, you know, part of it is, what are the impacts?
You know, how has this come about?
You know, there's many pieces to this.
And I think this is local, too.
I understand the point they're raising
with the Trump administration.
And, clearly, that is a problem at the federal level.
We've seen it even now with this Qatari Air Force One offer.
There's a whole host of things there.
But for this, this is about, again,
looking at it locally, looking at the issues.
And I want to engage with those three individuals
on this topic.
-Still getting some information on that one.
Councilmember Saka, let me throw this at you
with another question that came in from a viewer.
"If Seattle City Council passes new ethics rules
allowing councilmembers to vote on issues,
where they have a conflict of interest,
what's the first issue Councilmember Bob Kettle
and Councilmember Rob Saka
would take on that they're currently conflicted out
of voting on?"
I know Councilmember Rivera has disclosed
she's a landlord for some property in Seattle.
Do you have some conflicts?
What are your thoughts about this?
-I -- So, first of all,
the premise of the question assumes
that there's some sort of grand conspiracy
or a cabal to, like, unwind or undo
or,, like impose some new --
I don't -- I don't know. Uh, I --
So, with respect to the underlying proposed legislation
on ethics,
that is an issue,
so I no longer sit on the Governance Committee,
where that's currently being heard, um,
but my office is paying close attention.
I do have some of my own questions and concerns.
Uh, I think, at a high level, it's a valid --
it serves a valid purpose,
especially if the underlying recommendation
is coming directly from the commission itself
and the director of the commission.
Um, but all of this to say,
we'll be tracking and monitoring that, going forward.
I'm, uh, right now, focused on advancing my own public safety
and transportation focused agenda.
And I don't know about these tinfoil hats
and grand conspiracies,
but it does make good clickbait. I'll say that.
-I think it's a bigger issue about ethics,
and I think people have some questions about it. Please.
-Can I add one thing, too?
Because we get a lot of heat
and there's a lot of statements made, you know,
and they're not really grounded in reality
because the nine of us are all your basic, average Seattleites,
to one degree or another.
And, um, we're not going to be leveraging this
to get rich or whatever.
You know, this is -- As I said on the dais --
just because the King County Assessor
increased the value of my home by a good amount
or the stock market's been inflated, you know,
our net worth and our financial backgrounds
are pretty straightforward.
You know, obviously, the rental property piece
is really the hang-up.
But you know, us in general, we're not that kind --
We're not Trump or anything close to that.
We're much closer to the average Seattleite,
you know, who also has a lot of inflated house values
and, you know, 401(k) values,
although that may be coming down now.
And so, this idea that, you know, there's the cabal,
you know, this, like, oh, we're -- you know,
machinating all these different pieces
is wrong for all -- I believe, for all nine of us.
I'm speaking for myself.
And and, to directly answer your question,
it's very clean for me.
I used to be a landlord.
I'm not anymore, for, like, 7, 8 years.
And, you know, everything's been cleaned up.
Very simple. -Okay. All right. Thank you.
I know this is a big issue.
It sounds like you're still both wrestling with this a bit,
so let me move on to a piece,
and I have maybe 30, 40 seconds for this one.
Council member Kettle, as of a few weeks ago,
we've seen what it would be like
to have a relatively car-free Pike Place Market.
There's some road construction work going on,
so the market's closed to most vehicular traffic.
Is this going to be permanent?
A lot of people are asking.
-You know what? This is a good news story.
You know, last year, SDOT,
they were looking to basically impose a solution.
I pulled out of the Seattle Transportation Plan
with the help of my colleague, Chair Saka.
And then we started this process where we got,
you know, a review and everything.
We bring in all the stakeholders,
and now we're bringing that out, and then we're leveraging
the utility work that's going on to test,
and what we can do to enhance that experience,
but then also be able to protect the businesses that are there.
So I'm working with the PDA at Pike Place Market,
not Pike's Place Market, by the way.
-Yes, thank you very much. -[ Chuckles ]
And also SDOT, and I have to say,
Director Emery has been doing a fantastic job.
She was there with me for a half day, plus conference,
and that kind of dedication is important.
-Thank you. We need to start wrapping up,
and I want to talk about the budget process
I know you're getting into.
You mentioned this $240 million deficit.
I think part of that is based on a cut
in federal transportation funding, potentially out there,
which I know you're paying attention to.
I need a minute, if I could, with you.
Your approach to the budget process this year?
-Yeah. So, I think, at a high level,
the punch line is this --
everything and everything --
anything and everything is on the table.
What does that mean?
We need to comb over with a fine-toothed comb
and review all of our budget priorities.
Mine -- public safety,
transportation and infrastructure, parks,
uh, high-level,
and programs and services
mapped to that, very high-level.
So, we also need to consider consolidations
of lines of businesses and potential cuts.
We also need to consider potential new revenue options.
Last year, I was proud to co-sponsor an effort,
sponsored as a prime sponsor by my colleague,
Councilmember Moore,
for the Capital Gains Tax in Seattle.
I thought then, and I think today
it's the right tax idea at the wrong time.
Later this year during budget,
we need to evaluate and assess everything.
Anything and everything is on the table.
So, that's how I will be approaching the budget.
-Okay. Thank you very much for that.
Councilmember Kettle, there's an interesting
public safety angle here, too.
The state just passed House Bill 2015 this session
to authorize local jurisdictions to enact a 0.1% sales tax
potentially, to pay for public safety needs.
The mayor's been kind of warm on this one.
Some thoughts about this?
Could this be a good tool for the budget?
-This is something that we need to look at.
It's funny 'cause yesterday, I had mentioned,
we had a brief discussion -- I had a brief discussion
with King County Councilmember Jorge Barón,
who has the equivalent committee on the King County Council.
And so, this is something that we're looking at.
As Councilmember Saka said,
all things need to be on the table.
And can I just say, for me, personally, it's like,
hey, how can we support those traditional areas of revenue?
You know, the B&O, the REIT, like --
We've been doing a lot.
And then it's about, hey, how can we actualize this
to create that revenue?
And I'll also say, as I am the maritime guy,
that the port is responsible
for a good third, almost, of our revenue,
so we should be looking to support them as well.
And I think we can do so.
-All right. Interested to see what happens there.
Councilmember Kettle, Councilmember Saka,
thank you very much for being with me.
-Thank you. -Thank you very much.
-And we'll see you next time on "Council Edition."
♪♪