We are here to talk about what is happening
with federal policy changes and the Seattle Center region.
And we have a panel of luminaries, local policy experts
to share their experiences, their work, and,
the, the inside look at how
policy is made in the current volatile
moments.
To my immediate left is Mike Fong, who's,
executive director of economic development for us and County.
Before that went, we the Department of Commerce for the state.
Before that, you were deputy mayor.
So, so city of Seattle.
Speaking of mayors of Seattle, to his left
is Jessyn Farrell, who's currently W Eric Seattle.
And is had wear many hats,
including what director of choice choices coalition
Pacific had signed with Nick Hanauer group state legislator
many towns there
and finally on the far side
Sue Rahr, former King County sheriff for interim chief of police
and currently strategic consultant to various Public Safety office.
This one is not beyond.
Thank you for being here with us.
We're excited to have this conversation and I'm thrilled to share it with.
So, first question and maybe we'll start with you, Jessyn.
Tell us how the group sort of from your vantage?
Well, the thing is to say, before jumping into questions, is
each of these folks is bringing a mix of different kinds of policy
expertise as well as kind of their their sort of current professional hats.
So, I'm hoping, Jessyn, you can kind of talk about
budget situation at the city and particularly the implications
for social spending in, in the communities and neighborhoods.
Soon you to talk about law enforcement
and public safety in the city and why might you talk about that?
Development, tariffs, trade, what have you.
And also there's a, there's a,
there's sort of a, a for a soul of climate knowledge as well.
But we just said produce.
And so we've got a number of different policy areas represented here
and hope what we can do is learn what's going on in, both in local policy
and also inside the agencies that are implementing these programs
that are currently at the center of the storm of,
changes coming out from the feds.
So our first question group, maybe Jessyn, you can start is,
how are the changes that the feds have been rolling out?
Both legislation in Congress and with, various executive orders for the Trump
administration shaping, and affecting
public programs and services this
evening.
- Everyone, I hope you can hear me.
Thank you for putting on such a beautiful evening to a very dark and intimate look.
Appreciate that to talk policy. Awesome.
These are my people.
So, you know, I think first, just to talk a little bit
about the city budget, I think one of the and, you know, the myriad of,
actions that have just been, you know, the flooding,
the zone in terms of what, what keeps coming from the federal level,
either through executive action, through extrajudicial action, through,
you know, congressional action, there's a lot happening.
And so I, I think it's from the city standpoint where we sit right now
in the fall of 2025, we actually don't have that many impacts yet.
And that's because a lot of the funding that we do receive
from the federal government is passed through dollars that come through already
existing legislation for Health and human services or for transportation,
or is in the form of groups that have already been encumbered.
And, we are absolutely litigating to say
that we should have that money and we are spending it going forward.
So from this vantage point, at this moment right now,
we actually haven't felt that many impacts,
even though there's just been this, you know, complete dust storm of action
that's been rolling eastward from Washington, DC for the last,
you know, many months.
That said, we obviously expect that there are going
to be really profound impacts, and it comes in a lot of different forms.
You know, this is a later question that just to touch on it,
one is just the economic uncertainty.
You know, our tax base really depends on the economic
vitality of many, many sectors.
And, the fact that there's just so much uncertainty,
especially with things like tariffs and being a trade
dependent state, that that means that things like sales
tax may be impacted, the consumers aren't feeling as, as confident.
It also means that, transportation.
So, for example, in a transportation universe where we may
have expected, through dollars are typical,
grants that we would usually get on big infrastructure projects,
they might be changing the rules to of give to cities like Seattle.
So we don't know what ask.
Well, and I think the other big thing that we know is going to be happening
is that our partners, especially our nonprofit sector partners
that deliver a lot of services, they are going to be impacted.
So one of the real essential questions for the city of Seattle, then, is to
what extent are we going,
you know, trying to cover where things might snap benefits.
We actually don't administer Snap benefits.
Those are so the benefits for very low income people.
But we do have food programs.
So one of the policy questions that will have to be wrestling
with in the months to come is to what extent are we having to change
or pivot or expand for choosing to expand?
Where is the money coming from?
So, so again, this moment, even though there's just been a lot of
experience, we don't have a huge difference in what
you'll see coming from the government, but we don't expect to complete this task.
Well.
For sure.
Sure.
Okay.
- First of all, do you think that moderating it's a pleasure to be here?
I see everybody, I can actually see anyone out there.
Oh, I know, I know, you're out there, so, but just to dovetail off of
just referrals, comments, you know, for us and so much probably
so very similar dynamics at play and I think maybe one, important,
component of this to emphasize is that there are lagging
indicators everywhere, around all of the stuff.
So we have spent the better part of the last 8 or 9 months reacting
to chaos, a lot of change in policy,
a lot of nuance at the, operational level or agency level, trying to decipher
some of the policies that have been coming out of this administration,
whether it be executive order or congressional actions.
But really important to emphasize that even, you know,
as my team listed economic indicators, it's just full of contradictions.
So, you know, we see imports up, exports down.
We see, you know, SBA lending
breaking last year's, record across the state.
We talked to.
And I have anecdotal conversations with City of Eyes and such as Business
Impact northwest and others.
And they're seeing strong small business lending activity.
And yet the on the street, commentary
from business owners and entrepreneurs is, is a tightening of working capital,
less risk taking, retrenchment, as far as growth strategies,
but at the same time, we don't we don't necessarily
see any of that showing up, in the data.
You know, unemployment in Washington state and locally in the county,
relatively stable.
It's up a little bit for 4.5%.
But we see things on the horizon that give us more in that,
a rough time, could be ahead.
For instance, we see softening, surprisingly, we read the papers,
we see softening in the, manufacturing and the tech sectors.
We see strength in health care and education.
So, and we also know that a lot of,
layoffs or folks that have been
let go, in some of these sectors have had severance packages and have a tail.
You when you start seeing those UI claims start to show up in the data.
And we're just about at the point where in the next quarter or two,
we expect to see some of that
data show up, and be felt across the region.
UI is, on play on the unemployment insurance question.
So, so, I say that, because I also want to note
that I am returning to the local government, after,
you know, a couple of years at state commerce and a couple of years
at FDA of retail ministry and there have been some striking,
realities.
Been reinforced to me in the context of this conversation around federal funding.
So, for instance, in our county,
we have a general fund of about $325 million.
The, which comparatively does the city of Seattle's
nearly 1.5 billion general fund has.
So, so roughly $300
million in general fund tax revenue, 80% of that.
And county government is essentially going to criminal justice
system and public safety.
So that leaves roughly 70 to $80 million.
But what I really think about is true discretionary spend by local government,
in general, fund allocation for for the county,
the federal dollars that are directly coming to the county,
either through direct grants and pass through grants for the state,
is roughly $78 million and handle this itself.
So the sheer volume and percentage of impact that we have,
that is at the county government level, that comes from federal resources
is pretty significant.
And we do not have the same.
How should I say it when I'm in Sonoma County?
I speak to them about luxuries of Seattle, King County
as far as, Levy supported,
taxpayer investments with the 1% property, the tax cap is enormously handicapped
to our ability to maintain, just basic services as you layer on top of that.
It's such an extraordinary reliance on federal funding
that just do day to day operations, that the chaos
and the variability and expectations and this of uncertainty around
what's what is going to remain and what is it has taken up so much bandwidth,
mobile, and staff that just in worker productivity alone, we have lost dramatic,
dramatic, capacity, just in the last 8 to 9 months.
So and it continues because we continue to try to figure out how to interpret
by actions at the county and what we can acceptable.
We can't accept it.
Funding and the relative risk associated with it.
We continue to, day to day face new, communication from agencies
about expectations of grants around public works,
infrastructure, human services, hunt, etc..
So, you know, all that to say that we are in a very fluid and we're reacting
in real time and it's, you know, it's a real challenge because challenge.
So what do you see?
- You know, we just.
I you know, it's it's it's interesting
as sure as you're talking about the impacts the criminal justice
them, you know, where are they going to be able to to 70 to 80% of all the money.
And so everybody needs this because we have a lot.
But that part of the part of the problem of.
We say to show you some kind of a medical analogy.
When human services and housing and education,
everything's working well, that's like preventative medicine.
And not that many people get sick.
The cops are in, like, the emergency room.
And so when we see all these federal cutbacks to human services,
the way that I look at safety is the safety net phrase.
And, you know,
the cops are the last line of defense, and there's nobody else
at 3:00 in the morning when you're, you know, adult
child with mental illness is in the house.
You know, it's not ideal to send a cop.
But all of us other assistance,
we're not able to meet the needs of that person. So.
So there's there's that piece of it in terms of actual money
for for paying for local law enforcement.
It's pretty insignificant because there's federal partnerships
with some of the federal law enforcement agencies and task forces.
But in the big picture, that's really not the most significant impact
for for me, when I look at the funding that's coming out.
I most I most read about the human services
funding cuts to have it having a direct impact,
where I also see that having a big impact, though, isn't the federal level.
When we come to bigger picture, looking at public safety
and how we protect the community.
And a lot of progress was made on police reform efforts.
You know, starting with Obama, you know, going through
and there's a lot of research, a lot of programs, a lot of ideas
that were implemented to improve how we police.
And, I'm I'm on the board of directors for the National Policing Institute,
which is a non membership driven
organization that looks at best practices for policing.
Our funding is about 70% local grants.
And it's just been
and so several
programs that I've been affiliated with to look at diversifying
law enforcement better practices all through this call response.
All of that money stuff.
And so it's it's so discouraging to have made so much progress.
And that's going to trickle down to the local level.
And then of course, Department of Justice, you know, that's it's a horror show.
I think what.
- Thanks.
I'm curious if you can talk a little bit about what
the day to day work of, of government,
of, economic development work of sort
of the city and of law enforcement looks like right now.
And, Mike, you alluded to it a few minutes ago
when you sort of talked about the running around, trying
to figure out what we can and can't talk about or what we can
what what the latest lawsuit or court, decision means for,
for this funding stream or that program or that regulation.
But, give us a it's more of a flavor of what's going on
inside the bureaucracies or inside those nonprofit, community based partners
that are responsible for implementing policy.
This is where my sort of Evan school policy insight is to show
where I'm hoping that you can you can illuminate in for the audience.
But I assume maybe you can actually.
Mike. What what do you what do you say for sure? Sure, sure.
- So I'll give one, very concrete example that has taken up
probably the better part of the last 4 or 5 months
is, we had received
some, and again, it's an example of how,
as we go through the process of deciphering federal policy
and guidance from agencies, and then proceed through the litigation
process, information with the state and county, the one of the most, comes
readily in mind for me in terms of just how much bandwidth it's taken us around,
HUD funding, around continuum of care.
We had about $17 million of funding
annually that essentially supports the safety net that,
Sue was talking about.
Just just how and spread across a whole series of programs,
everything from behavioral health to, homelessness, shelters, etc..
And, you know, we heavily rely on,
on that funding to keep the safety net operational.
And we went through a series of
start stops, two steps forward, two steps back.
We're not going to get the funding or the need to sign this that.
And the other thing is comply with all of the president's executive orders.
We said, no, we're not going to do that.
And we'll sue.
And there's no funding coming in until the litigation is resolved.
By the time you have nonprofit providers throughout the whole service continuum
that are wondering when the fiscal year starts on July 1st.
Is the county going to continue to pay the bills?
And the truth is, is that the amount of time that we had to spend
either identifying contingency funding or essentially issuing 6090 day notices
that, you know, with funding will probably cease to continue
if we don't see the releasing of funds from the federal government.
And it just creates, you know, pandemonium and chaos at the FAA
from the agency level to our departments to nonprofit providers.
And this was essentially a 4 or 5, six month ordeal.
And again, it's just,
I mentioned productivity in that sense is so much bandwidth.
And time was taken up, developed contingency plans,
you know, communicating with providers, identifying
what else would have to be
had going through enormous, you know, zero based budgeting exercises
with the human services to try to identify what was fundable, what isn't.
And if we have to rerack this whole thing or that meme.
And then at the end of the day, we ended up getting the 17 million.
It was all for all for not real.
You know, so so it's hard to quantify that impact.
But but multiply that across
all your, your, your departments
and all the staff where this is really in some ways
not even their day to day responsibility, but have been pulled out of, day
to day operations in order to triage these issues.
And that doesn't even count the time.
We have to go hand to hand comment with the prosecuting attorney's office
of whether or not we should litigate any of these issues.
So, so so bottom line is, is that, it it is a constant churn
and has created the necessity to create all these new mechanics, you know, the,
the departmental agencies, some candidates focused on federal funding,
that honestly, are, are really just second nature
or under normal non Trump era, conditions,
you know, where you know, and instead of focusing on service delivery,
performance outcomes of those, service contracts
and again, aligning the systems, to deliver the best serve as possible.
We have people focus every day on just having to engage providers,
engage senior leadership, engage other regional, partners,
and to figure out what we're going to do, in the face of all of these
uncertainties.
And, and that's just one very, very specific example.
And, and I, I want to turn it over
to, to sue suggested, but I'll have two little anecdotes.
You know, we talk about the data is lagging indicators,
but there are a few things that I do want to point out that are very real.
One is around tourism and international travel into the state.
Yeah, I was just looking at some of this difficulty
and all the tough
talk around tariffs and all of the, the, the anti-immigration messaging.
They are across border crossings from Canada into Whatcom County.
Year over year, down 100,000 people in the month of August.
And that is reflected in the reduction in hotel
stays that we're seeing a reduction RV in these days.
And ultimately is going to be a reflection and reduction in sales
tax revenue generated.
And we are actually seeing some early indication
that we're going to be a few million dollars short of forecast on on sales tax.
So so all of this is going to start showing up a little bit later.
And, and that later is, is is on our doorstep.
Wow. Thanks, Jessyn.
- What what what are you seeing as the city of Seattle?
What are you what are your colleagues up to?
What are you seeing with the nonprofit partners?
- Oh, the sun is outside of the blue is in here.
I guess I to say, you know, I've been on the job for seven months as deputy mayor.
And what Mike is describing really feels like just what I think
deputy mayor does of a big city in Seattle,
which is a lot of sprawl, a lot of chaos, a lot of incoming.
So it's really hard for me to know, like what level
of additional chaos all of the stuff is versus
just the regular day to day chaos that happens in the mayor's office.
So, but I will say there kind of three things that are happening.
One is we are looking really proactively about how do we create,
resilience and stability in our budget and in the way we deliver services.
And one of those things is something that you,
will see
on the ballot in November, which is we worked with, the mayor
and council member and work together to put together a, you know, tax
package that shifts the taxation
so that you have a three, $2 million, profit.
And then we adjust rates beyond that.
But what that does is it creates $30 million
in funding for us to be able to anticipate what may be coming,
you know, so we don't know exactly how the cuts are going to hit us,
but we are pretty darn sure they are going to be hitting us.
So we have this, tax package that then allows us to have some flexibility.
So that was actually very proactive work that we started
doing very intensively in the spring and early summer.
So we knew right away we were going to have to start thinking
about how to create resiliency in our in the way we deliver programs.
So that's one thing.
The second thing is we just have to pay for it.
You know, like there's still air pressure washing Third Avenue three times a day.
I hope you all like it,
but I spend a lot of time now.
You might just be home to clean up.
And I come to work, and I spend a lot of time
working with departments.
So we do a lot of that these days.
You know, the restroom audit, a lot of lot.
We're cleaning in our parks, restrooms.
So there just
is this level of delivering service every single day that we still have to do,
regardless of what, you know, utter chaos is happening.
At the federal level and it's expanded, but it is also just a really necessary
part of creating a livable, safe, economically vibrant city.
And then the third part is to my point, there really are these major efforts
that we've had to kind of gin up
really quickly to be able to respond and develop a strategy.
I mentioned our federal funding strategy, which is we believe
we are legally entitled to, and I know we're going to be spending it,
but we had to do a very thorough review of all of the ways that the city receives
federal funding to then be able to develop,
coordinated, holistic response across departments.
Similarly with the, you know,
the really deeply harmful, real time impacts
on immigrants and undocumented people in our community.
You know, that is a
continuing, evolving issue in how we deliver government services.
And there are a lot of different things that go into it working with our parks
workers to understand when somebody comes into a community center,
Ice comes into a community center, what are they supposed to do?
So we had to really quickly work with,
Elmira and director Deanna Hannah to really, you know, put together
trainings and communications in person workforce.
That's a really big thing to one.
Understand?
You know, what is it
that I'm just trying to do and what is it that is a proper response for us?
And then how do we communicate and training to our employees?
And that's been a really, really big effort that's layered on top
of all of the other stuff that needs to happen to to run big city.
Thanks.
That's that's very illuminating. And.
To, you're not working directly in a democracy
like our other panelists, but, you're talking about how do.
I thank you for this.
- So what are what are you hearing?
What are you seeing? What's what's life like?
Are we, in the,
sort of day to day world week to week, world of enforcement matters?
- Well, I think, Mike, that the concerns I have
about the impacts of what's happening are less physical and bureaucratic,
which that is fundamental, foundational stuff that has to happen.
What's breaking my heart is, is we're taking a giant step
backwards in building community trust
between the enforcement and the community.
Law enforcement can't do it alone.
And we, I think, particularly in Seattle, may significant strides
in improving the public relationship with our communities.
And that is just being decimated
by the tactics and the deliberate
intimidation tactics where wearing the masks, that's
I know there's there's all kinds of excuses given for them.
I don't buy any of them.
I just I just don't.
And unfortunately, many people in our communities,
whether they grow up here or whether they're new to the community,
they don't distinguish between the 16 different types of law
enforcement agencies that overlap in the same community.
DEA, FBI agents like Ice, local police, state police, county police.
They see somebody with a whole bunch of body armor on and police.
And it's all. It's all one thing.
And and I think what's happening is it's just it's
just so, so discouraging to see
that just being obliterated. And,
yeah, in terms of actual public safety in communities
that have many immigrants, many, many undocumented folks.
I, I really I really worry about the crime going up inside those communities
because her fringe, of course, the victims are afraid to report
because they themselves don't have any contact with the police.
And in a domestic situation, there's domestic violence
or that type of thing going on.
You know, the
they certainly don't want to have the person who's committing the act.
And so, so
I it's it that I think that's the biggest negative impact
I see I see is just obliterating that trust.
One group that I'm working with right now, we're talking about
putting together a program to,
help educate and give guidance to police chiefs and sheriffs,
law enforcement leaders about how do you resist,
unconstitutional federal coercion.
You know, we don't have to we don't have to look back through our own history
to look at the complicit behavior in, with the Nazis and with the police.
And there's some great programs that have been around for a long time
that that help teach local law enforcement
about the importance of keeping us separate. And,
it's it's really, really a it's going to be a difficult challenge
because we all know there are some folks in the forces that we very conservative.
And because we are in this political environment where there's only two sides,
there's no nuance. And in the middle,
it's a real
challenge to say, in my opinion, local law enforcement
is one of the cornerstones of what makes democracy real or not.
Liberty real or not, it's our civil rights.
It's our freedom.
And and when you suddenly have enforcement challenging that
what we stand for is not
- it gets reversed for free.
Let's look down the road a little bit and, wonder if we can have
a little bit more of a, of a conversation about kind of how some of these,
trends that,
that you can talk about emerging are like going to
intersect is a six months, a year
down the road at the street level, in the communities,
in the neighborhoods.
Specifically.
So you alluded to this earlier when you talked about,
law enforcement is kind of the, the, the, the,
the safety, their last resort right
there.
I'm curious if we can kind of explore what my friends in the social sciences
would call the interaction effects between these different, policy domains.
And so the bottom line is that, that we've been talking about,
what do we think, the intersection
of these economic trends that,
that might is as yet unsure how they will stand out?
And the, that, that sort of,
the seasonal shifts and looking down the road, adJessyng something that,
you know, likely some cutbacks as the wave of cuts, ripples westward from the east.
And then similarly, this, this expansion
of law enforcement presence.
And, in
different pockets of, of the, of the city in the region.
What's the nexus of that all going to look and feel like on the streets in
six months or a year.
I know I'm asking you to speculate.
This is where it gets this is where it gets interesting.
- Well, you know, I think we do look at the opportunity and look at,
you know, the pressure as a catalyst to examine what we're doing
and what we could do, that if there's less funding
for some of these different services, and we need to be much more efficient
with what we've got and stop wasting money in ways that don't make sense.
And and I was just talking to my good
friend Fred Jarrett before we sat down about the
the five institutions that have to come together when, when somebody is arrested
and booked and, and, and if we can get those five institutions
to work together contracted with police, jails, hospitals, the courts
and public health, we always forget to talk about public health,
because that is that that institution is probably the most important of all.
Five if we want to have a positive outcome.
When people think about a person being arrested and booked.
That sounds like, oh, that's the end of the road.
That's the final step.
We need to shift from thinking
that should be step one of an opportunity to shift this.
And if we can get those five institutions working together
toward the goal of get this person to stop committing crimes,
stop focusing on, you know, the only reason for arrest is deterrence,
is that that is a byproduct for some people that that should be the goal.
And I think that we could realize the real savings
if we stop looking at that as a final step and look at this as an opportunity.
There are some people, it's a fairly small percentage
that just need to be locked up, but that's a pretty small number.
And the rest of I think we could do a better job in science.
And so I guess what I'm saying is, is we have to save money.
Maybe that's the catalyst to force us to work together more effectively
if we have enough troops marching down the streets. I,
I, I don't even
I can't even imagine what that's going to look like.
Quite frankly.
We we don't have we don't have a model
for how we're going to handle that.
I mean, I would like to say, you know, I would resist,
you know, that's that's
my my son is God bless them, I think.
But what if his quotes when during his confirmation was I fully expect
I'm going to be arrested, you know, and and and he's he is an ethical guy.
And you know, I hope that we never get to that point
where he feels the need to say, I will not cooperate with you.
Federal law enforcement.
But I mean, still, this happened last year.
I can't wait to send somebody else.
- Well, I think
you just to on that note around, you know, some of the very terrifying
potentialities that we actually are seeing in other cities
and what does that look like in our own policymaking?
I think one of the things is, you know, how do you think about which states
are we picking?
We have the Trump administration and making sure that rooted in our values.
And I think I know that the mayor and the city of Seattle
feels very strongly that having a diverse workforce,
using policymaking as a way to rectify past injustices,
those are the things we believe in, and we're not going to stop it.
And so that's a fight that we are willing to have on us.
One of the reasons we're thinking about how do we start to create,
you know, the resiliency in our budget
because those are our values and we are going to stand up for those.
So that's that's one thing that we, we obviously are thinking about.
But I think to that question of what do things look like, six months from now,
one of the things that I'm thinking about are for those communities
that are all ready feeling the impacts of the Trump administration's
immigrants, undocumented people, trans members of our community, right.
There are people who are already experiencing really profound harm.
What are the things that we are doing to help
provide, you know, as a community, provide services?
So how are we think rethinking things like health care,
how are we investing more in legal aid?
You know, there are these things that maybe the city hasn't necessarily done,
and I'm not committing a standard thing, and I want to get in front of,
you know, the, the policy and, and the mayor.
But but there are these things that are going to change how we know
we're going to have to be nimble to be able to meet the moment,
because there are people in our community that are already suffering.
So we need to be, you know, for those of us who believe in progressive
government and believe that government does have a role to play and,
you know, in
creating a, safe, thriving community, you know,
we are going to have to be nimble and adapt to to what
society.
- So six, first of all, here,
couple thoughts come to mind.
One, I think,
that's the reinforcing to just an impact.
I think there's a lot of recalibration going on right now in local government
to really think about, how,
what is to come, is going to be, some, some real reaction.
First of all, we have not seen any of the Medicaid Medicare implications.
And the health care system, impacts really start to materialize yet.
And that is going to put much more pressure on the social service safety net.
I think it's going to force the governments into prioritization exercise.
As far as what what are the must do's relative to the
I suppose to have something.
And that's just the reality.
And when we are forced into that conversation, it also means as we move
into the criminal justice system and the public safety, mechanics,
you know, you're going to see lots of jurisdictions have active conversation
about whether they're going to take the state authorized 1%
additional sales tax to help mitigate for loss of revenue.
And, and the public safety criminal justice system.
I know so much county will be considering that, very carefully
because it's all it's compounds, an existing structural problem
that already exists, which is that we are going to see sales tax revenue
decline and a 75, 80% for sales tax revenue
because the general fund goes to public safety,
it's pretty clear that we're going to be facing public safety
before justice system cuts and running right up against statutory requirements
as part of what we need to do as far as, investments in some of those areas.
So I think that's a reality.
Six months from now, we are going to be active.
We engaged in the conversation around how does this region,
and whether this region is prepared for the World Cup.
And our unique position, at least for us between Vancouver
and Seattle, puts us in a very unique situations for trying to capture
what we have seen as a huge opportunity to showcase our region,
capture sales tax revenue, showcase what, the county has to offer
and our mantra about come early, and come back, or stay late
is all to trying to build what what is an opportunity,
you know, a generational opportunity for us with eyeballs
on us across the globe to maximize that opportunity.
But are we going to be in a position to do so,
given the enormous budget pressures that we'll be under?
And also we talked about the the tough talk on immigration and tariffs
and other things, as already has had some residual impact
as far as what we think our our numbers are going to look like
as far as people coming out the United States for, for the children.
So so those are just a couple of areas.
And then I'll add one more that I think is,
there's certainly
cross-cutting policy interest here with, with Deputy Premier Farrell.
And that is the rollback of the,
clean energy and climate change commitments and incentives through IRA
are going to have impacts on Washington, because we've made such a huge bet
on the clean energy and green economic transformation
all that money that we have
on the Climate Improvement Act was intended to leverage so much from the IRA.
The Biden administration's efforts to really accelerate
transformation in this space.
And what I will say, in spite of the fact that there are,
you know, vast numbers of that $22 billion in canceled or lame projects
across the United States on clean energy resulting from the.
So the Trump administration rollbacks of the first six months of this year.
But in spite of that and those headwinds, the truth is, is what I talked
to clean energy and clean tech and cream, companies across our region.
It's it's really still full steam ahead, because the reality is, is that
the global market dynamics of the market transformation that's happening
is so strong that
in spite of what Trump and the fence are trying to do,
the reality is, is that the policy foundation and economics and where
the trajectory the sector is going is that really it's a lot of stay.
The course is what I'm hearing from the folks,
and some of that is even reflected in things like,
you know, talking to Geneseo, the folks that do the heat pump distribution
across the state, you know, they see, yeah, flattening 1% growth, but they also
see that even though tax incentives may be going away from the feds,
the local policies require us to move towards a clean energy.
You know,
20, 40, you know, clean energy, 100% clean
energy across the state is driving that transformation regardless of of.
Tax incentives. Right?
So we're talking to the hopes of installing heat pumps and saying that
they're still backlogged several months in terms of projects, just people.
And now people are actually rushing to try
to get that work done before the tax incentive goes away.
And even in that space, it's a mixed bag because you may see
management from the fence around solar and wind and a few other things
and other spaces such as sustainable aviation fuels and hydrogen and other
and certainly nuclear, small modular nuclear and other technologies.
You actually see continued investment and emphasis in this space.
And so as a state
and having traveled the state in the last couple of years, is commerce
director to see where our footprint is on clean energy transformation.
I actually think we're going to stay the course.
We may not have the same leveraging that we had before, but the realities are
that the economics are still driving that,
that sector, and we're going to keep leaving.
And that's our intent.
- Can I add on to that the numbers?
- I think Deputy Mayor Mike downs.
Yeah.
I you know, I actually feel very similarly to Mike on this.
You know, I've worked on environment and climate issues for 25 years
and except for this really awesome three years of hydrogen station.
So that's not going to partner, you know, on most of the time.
And in fact, it wasn't until 2016, I think.
And I know we live in a factory era, but if somebody wants to actually get
the facts or numbers, I think it was around 2016
that the Supreme Court said that the EPA could finally regulate climate emissions.
You know, so that's not in that ball.
We have a lot of,
policymaking, civic muscle memory and civic
infrastructure around climate and the environment here.
That means that all of those things that I'm just talking about
are going to continue.
Maybe we don't get the scale that we would have gotten with the federal government.
And don't get me wrong,
the federal government is the partner is really important.
But for most of the time that I've been working on these issues,
the feds have been sometimes they're sometimes not
and sometimes really in the way.
And so I think that there's just a lot of bright spots in what we're doing.
I'll throw out a couple in addition to it taking the heat pump, issue.
And this is something that Mike and I worked on together
when you were at Commerce with state and local dollars.
We are on, we are on a trajectory to switch out
all of our oil heated homes in Seattle has 8000 homes by 2030.
And we chose oil heated homes because those are the most emissions
from our residential.
And that's awesome. And that is just federal.
And that's that's just state and local dollars.
So that's a real bright spot.
And there's so many
other things that the city and the region and our tribal nation partners
and the state are doing to really,
get in front of a climate crisis, particularly around resiliency
and preparation.
So that's actually a place where,
you know, they can spin around and fight, you know,
whatever off his golf course in Scotland, the wind.
No, it's whatever.
But we have what it takes here to continue to move forward
and to continue to make that transition and to really make,
you know, our place a livable place,
even in spite of the increasing threat of climate change.
- So we're going to open it up for questions.
But let me just try to tie a couple of threads here together before
I, the audience to join us, join the conversation.
What's neat about ending on that note is, first of all, it's helpful.
But secondly, it highlights what the local and regional capacity
for innovation can be when we get creative and when we are thinking sort of
outside of the traditional agency silos,
outside of the traditional government does this business does that,
the community does this other thing, and that's where I hope
we get some of this action in the jail, arrest and booking process.
That's where hopefully we can get some action in the tourism space.
And that's where, I think a lot of the conversations
that we're having in the Evans School, I think solutions, how do we catalyze
that innovation within the bureaucracy so that all this churn.
Yes, you have to do it, but at least the bureaucracy is humming
and not just emailing itself, which is sort of what
a lot of our jobs actually look like day to day.
So hopefully we're going to create some
some more innovations in the region and in the state and locally and
and start to, to chart a path and take advantage of of what, what
how did you say to the edge of the crisis is an opportunity also always, always.
Let's hope so. Okay.
So we have we have 40 minutes or so for our conversation and questions.
What would you like to ask the panel.
-
Doctor we can
done. Brazil.
What a piece of the Washington Post today.
Largely focused on her and her old mentor.
I mean, not to run day to day.
But she was also describing the,
takeover of DC as an occupied city.
My first of all, if we're looking backwards
towards Trump, it's always towards the next point.
It's, you know, I have this image of sort of black
shirted Portland Portland art competitors joining us in.
Everything from the stuff, what they're going to come.
So when you're not hoping that we can make those
five bucks justice or not hoping that we can get,
people who are even still, despite all this,
how do you see how are you doing?
The plan for the invasion.
- So, I'm going to repeat the question so that our friends watching out there
in Seattle. Tabletop.
To hear the question in a nutshell is, let me see if I get this right.
What are we what what what is the region doing to plan for an occupied city?
Shouldn't come to that close enough.
Without giving away trade secrets.
Yeah. What's going on in the back room?
- Yeah.
You know, I, I would go back to that.
Where are we picking fights?
Because we know that so much of the apparatus that the Trump folks use
is based on instigation and poking at us and getting us to, you know,
come out and, and, and, you know, and take the bait in a lot of ways.
And so there's on the one hand, not doing that.
And then on the other hand, drawing, you know,
like boundaries around what our values are and being willing to stand up for that.
And that is, very nuanced, delicate balance
that, you know, we are figuring out as we go.
I would point to though, you know, you may have paid attention to,
there was a, right wing pastor who had come to Cal Anderson in May.
And, you know, there were a lot of critiques of how that went.
They came back in August, and it was a very different experience.
And that's in part because we adjusted how we respond, how
we plan, how we work with community groups and how we even,
you know, you know, again, work across across our, our regional partners too.
So, so we are adJessyng as we go.
And again, I think having a mindset of fullness of really working,
you know, our bureaucratic communications
structures and being able to permeate across departments as really,
really important, we often get in the way of ourselves
and our response, but we need to be responding.
So we're really building up that sinew internally
so that as we need to be nimble, we have the,
you know, the things inside to be able to and,
and also the relationships with community to be able
to to navigate this.
- Sue do you have any.
- Well, I want to be careful because I can't speak
about the state of the current state police department,
but I can't tell you the the ground is different now
than it was in 2020, and the cooperation between city departments is much better.
I just I don't, I don't I, I think I'm crazy how much I love your pressure.
What she's done.
But I'm telling you,
sometimes you need a tangible, visible thing
to demonstrate that that something has changed.
And it was the cooperative efforts between escalated police departments
to care to, all of these different city departments worked together.
And that's why we saw such a transformation
along the pipeline corridor that didn't
exist in 2020, as far as I can tell.
So so you have the you have the leadership and the mayor's office
and the leadership in the Seattle Police Department are on the same.
They're working together.
And and that gives me so much hope.
Is it is that and is there.
So you're not going to have the chaos at the top that happened to 2020.
And and I think going forward you have four more years of building
relationships with the community. And I think
there's value in that foundation
that's been built there.
- That's that's really a key insight, I think.
But do you have anything to add on this or not to you guys?
I'm, gearing up for a or armed,
fortress.
- Well, using trade secrets, I can't
I sorry, it oh.
Well, I the only thing, that actually dovetails off of,
to this is that I just think
that two things on government capacity, I
there's been a lot of new muscle memory learned since the pandemic.
And, and that muscle memory
is something that I have been trying to,
reinforce or the necessity of being able to carry
through into post-Covid, operations.
And because there were things that were done in the middle of the pandemic
that are inconceivable for government bureaucrats
like myself, you know, over the 25 years and,
and the the ability of the, of the government to mobilize at
times of crisis is, is actually when it's working is an extraordinary thing.
And and the second part of that is I think it's incredibly important for us
to, in the background context of an environment,
that is so toxic around,
the public sector and governments.
And, you know what the messaging coming out of DC is about,
public service is that it's so crucial for us to
maintain that, important capacity within local government,
regional government and state government that that talent, that expertise
in that experience, should be celebrated, you know, because those are the folks
that are going to be the ones who are relying on,
you know, in a crisis situation.
And having been in those rooms, you know, I know this,
you know, we we cannot afford a brain drain at City Hall or county government,
you know, and if anything, we should be embracing, absorbing the folks fleeing DC,
coming home and bringing them back into local public service.
Because when, when, when we needed and when the occupation or whatever
it may be comes down the line, I'm going to sleep better knowing that
the people at City Hall and County Hall in the emergency Operations Center
are people that know what they're doing and are going to act in our best interest.
And if we can maintain that, and we all have a role in supporting
our public servants and knowing that they will step up
when we need them to,
but we can't afford to keep them down any further in an environment like this.
With, with the way the Trump administration's message and their work and so
- that's what questions.
Yeah.
So one thing I find really striking about the conversation is
there has been no mention of artificial intelligence
lights or media is
obsessed with.
And so I would just curious to hear stories,
and chat GPT two, write their articles,
which.
I'm kidding, I'm kidding.
The stories,
disruption, crisis,
opportunity that are showing up in your work
as a result of of as a result of artificial.
Okay.
So the question then if I, if I can paraphrase it is, are there
stories, are there examples of how artificial intelligence
is showing up in the work of government these days?
Your work specific?
- Yeah, I work specifically. Not at all.
I mean, honestly, because so much of the work I oversee
parks and transport and sustainability and the office of the waterfront and so,
so much of that work is really, truly the day to day taking care
of our physical spaces.
And, you know, I'm sure that there are back end functions,
maybe around traffic operations that I'm not familiar with.
And I will say that the city of Seattle
is, you know, doing pilots around artificial intelligence.
That's kind of outside of my purview.
So maybe the next guest you can have will be someone who is really more
deeply steeped in.
That's not to say that it isn't
a huge transformation that's coming and a huge transformation
that will have some real value and surreal disruption in the.
Delivery of government services.
But that for now is an area that I'm, that I'm really deeply focused on.
So I can't answer answer that other than to ask ChatGPT
to write an answer for me.
Which I don't even really know how to use.
- Here we go.
I think not specifically artificial intelligence,
but just the technology that we can rely on to
to bring multiple data sources together,
to identify crime patterns or, I'm probably going to scare you all now,
but there is there is so much data being collected
on every single one of us, every moment that we're in public spaces.
And we now have the technological ability to track through license plate
from essentially back
out of your garage, into your drive into Seattle Park, in the parking garage.
And it's so fast to be able to track where people are going,
you know, you know, the dark side of this is it creeps me out.
I don't want the government tracking where I am.
But when I was sitting in the police chief chair and we have a horrific crime,
you're damn right I want to know exactly where was that license plate
for the hour before the homicide and for the half hour after the homicide?
Because we can be far more effective
at crime prevention and crime fighting if we use the data properly.
But we have to focus on.
I think we we spend so much time focusing on the technology itself,
and we have to be having a lot more conversation about the policy
and what happens
where the data is already being sucked up, and mostly by private funders.
This is not necessarily the government, grabbing
all of this data, but what are we doing with the data?
Who gets to look at it and who gets to, you know, mix and match together?
There's a there's a lot of opportunities there.
But mostly people are focusing on the technology and not the policy.
- Yeah, I know
I don't have much to add on this, so I will provide one anecdote,
which is that I was talking on a talking with our I.T director
just last week, and the natural inclination for us
to say, oh, in the space of AI, we should that, you know,
we should be thinking about how we might innovate for the future
of what government looks like, and interacting with the public.
And I raised this point with him in his response to me was actually the
the posture that we have taken thus far has actually been to be a little bit,
cautious when it comes to I we're not actually leaning
leaning in as much as I would have thought and that we actually a good,
and this is
probably too strong or perhaps let a few others innovate first
before we start to, move into that space more proactively.
So so, you know, I thought that was an interesting,
active anecdote, just pulling back the curtain
that we've
we have the committees and folks
looking at various pilots and potential areas of opportunity with.
But it is not you know, it is it has not entered a day to day,
policy or operational conversation for me whatsoever. So,
- to speak to this from, from the standpoint of the urban schools
of our School of Public Policy governance, University of Washington, and we we,
we teach, we talk to, policy analysts.
And I think there is some growing use of, of generative
AI in, in, sort of an analytic space.
Again, it's a little bit,
I mean, very different in terms of the way the data is used,
but it's a little bit analogous to what we're talking about
in that there, there are these big data, big databases out there.
And so an analyst can get a heck of a lot more done if they could ask,
a chat, a chat,
GPT or a copilot to, you know,
do a synthesis of a bunch of different stuff from databases.
So, so there are definitely some, some policy workshops out there
that are, that are, that are working with it and,
the other thing
I should say is on the, on the police policing
enforcement data front, our colleague Asim Kaushik has a new podcast.
Is is it, Seattle I sleep yeah, yeah.
I'm Seattle surveil more so you can hear the dulcet
tones of Sandeep and his colleagues on this. Yeah.
Nice podcast exploring. Exactly.
The question is who is talking about.
- Okay, don't lose sight of the fact that it's private companies
that have personal data.
It's not like government's just out there.
And that's I think a really that's a really tricky conversation
is how much those private companies are willing or pushing out that data
and how much they're charging for it.
- Yeah, I guess I mean, as a as a private consumer, I'm not really too
excited about, you know, all of my text messages
going up in the cloud and anybody who wants me
one down and I'm ready to stream that really funny meme.
Hey you.
It's really funny when I send
- like, okay, everybody go look up Susie.
Instagram.
Next question.
- Yeah. Just say, high school.
This is, this is our colleague Stephen billions of looked at. Hi.
I'm serious.
And this is really because I'm like you said, super tech when you think about it.
But I'm curious about how you guys are dealing with the challenge of keeping.
And even this is restoring trust in the public institutions
that you're working in at a time
where the federal government is so good at undermining that trust.
I almost I thought about it in that context a little bit.
Two of the conversation around surveillance, where there's this
sort of fear around if we surveil more, does that help Trump justify or not?
I'm not the expert at all on that, but I'm just curious about
how you guys are seeing that in your day to day roles where
the sort of trust in government has an all time low.
- So the question is, how are you seeing,
trust in government play
out right now, which is sort of the, the federal level,
and elsewhere are actively trying to undermine trust in government.
And then are there ways in which you and your work
or the jurisdictions of the agencies that you work with,
actively trying to restore trust in government and build it?
Where where are their success stories out?
There are the sort of promising targets of opportunity
- and talent success story, maybe, you know.
So, Stephen, I think that is in some ways one of the defining issues
of our political era, which is how do institutions
either work for someone or not work for someone who feels left out?
I institutions
who feels harmed by institutions who feel served by institutions.
Right. That does that so much. I think,
disappointment, anger, rage, broken promises.
You know, that a lot of people across different
socio economic demographic, racial groups
feel about government right now and about institutions, probably.
So I feel like that is one of the defining features of our political era.
You know, for the last ten years, at least, with the post meltdown,
you know, 2008.
But I will tell a story of where I think trust really figured prominent
and being able to make a really big policy difference.
And this is related to the building admissions
standard, fondly known as Baps.
This is the media's signature environmental legislation.
And I got to help negotiate.
This this luggage basically requires our largest building owners downtown
to decarbonize their buildings by 2050.
And this single policy will reduce emissions of Seattle by 10%.
That's a big thing.
Now, we only need to do that nine more times,
and we've reduced provisions and it's great.
But I
will say that trust played a huge role.
And it's the jokes
I like to make about this policy
is this is one of the few instances where the only instance where both DSA
and our community were able to be in kind of this orbit, where
socialists were at the negotiating table, the downtown association
was at the negotiating table, and we were able to thread that
needle and get to a policy that, well, maybe not everyone liked.
Everybody was able to get to at least neutral
or an enthusiastic yes, on which was really important.
And we did that, in part because of trusted relationships
in the business community
where people were able to come to the table and talk to us,
and also trusted relationships in the labor and community advocacy,
communities that were built through things
like the Green New Deal Oversight Board, the Office of Sustainability
and Environment administered and so created a space where an entity,
OSB, could build relationships with people in our community
who may not be very trusting of government and what government says.
And, and yet we were able to really build a policy
that is very ambitious, that is really going to take a lot
for building owners to actually achieve and will make a real difference
in our own city's emissions and the jobs that we create,
and the fact that we're creating safer buildings for people to be in.
And, you know, in a smoky day or a really hot day.
So that's an example where, bringing those deep community
relationships really, really matters and then has a benefit in being able
to move policy
- for the director of the Office of sustainability of the environment at that time was it wasn't me.
All right.
Restoring trust in government.
How are you guys doing? The story?
- Well, I mean, I still
I think what I can say about this is this,
as we are dealing with
everything that's sort of for a while there, it seemed like a daily, occurrence
as far as something new coming out of the administration for the,
part of the tactical of chaos
theory, of just pushing as much out as quickly as possible,
and it puts local government, I think, in a very difficult situation
where we are asked to,
reassure and, provide some certainty
in the in the context of uncertainty and when we don't have the answers.
And because this is, this is both the challenges of local government
and why I love local government so much, is that because you're on
you're on the front line, you're at the front door,
and that's where the questions are going to come.
Even if we have absolutely no idea what Trump's latest
EO means or what this is going to do to immigration policy,
or how law enforcement will interact with communities.
And all we can do is really, I and I, I've seen this over the last six,
nine months as a real effort to try to engage and have open dialog
with particularly communities that have been most vulnerable
to some of these, attacks,
so to speak, from, from, from this administration.
And even when we have not had the answers is, is, has been a willingness
to sit down at the table and have that have that.
I can actually simply acknowledge that we don't
we don't have the answers in most cases.
And when we do or when we know that there is competing policy,
whether that be, and this is most
notably in the law enforcement space, I think in terms of,
immigration policy
and cooperation with the, with the Ice and other things, it's
it is really important, I think, for local leadership to,
to be vocal about standing up for those, those values.
And I know we've talked a lot about that, how far that can go.
And in a, in a climate where there are are trust deficiencies to begin with.
And it's also worth noting that that dynamic and for me has been
acutely noteworthy that it is different in the Seattle versus,
Thomas County or rural county versus, you know, Dane County.
And so so it does take,
some nuance as far as how you're going to interact
and communicate with, the public.
But in, in this context, I think it's, I think having really
that we have leaned in and have robust communication where possible,
but also acknowledging that there are there are things where we just
don't have answers to it doesn't necessarily,
that might
reassure folks, but at least they know that we are
you know, we're processing this in real time with with them as well.
And, and I love,
you know, I mean, it's a great question in terms of the broader, dynamics of the
the erosion of the confidence of the government, of our institutions
all across the board, part of us administration's playbook here.
I don't have a good answer for,
but it's something that that is terrifying every single day.
As far as, you know, we have all these ingredients of,
you know, really, really, really bad for democracy indicators.
You know, in terms of the, the, the massive misinformation
that's out there in so many different channels, the,
the systematic and the breaking down, and you get them
and manipulation and destruction of our, of our institutions.
And then the, the, the polarization and divisive politics all are contributing
in such a negative way to the climate that, you know, I mean, the, the,
the level of fear, is palpable, you know, and, I wish I had an answer.
Of what what we can do to to mitigate for that.
But truly we are.
We are in constant reactive mode.
And if there is a way for us to, to, to,
to move out of that, that would certainly certainly help.
But but right now it is, it is, it is largely reactive
and at times and county is like the homeless and really entails
at least 38 counties other than the kingdom itself.
The tools are allowed to, you know, in terms of what we can do,
we don't necessarily have the ability to bolster with a vote on tax reform,
a proposal that we can, you know, to, mitigate for federal, funding reductions.
We just can't
we can't see the same political dynamics as there might be in different parts
of the state.
Which which overlays a really, really significant challenge
for those of us who are trying to keep the wheels on the,
you know, on busses.
- Steve, could I add something to that, though?
I and this kind of goes back to that I question I was thinking a little bit
about, you know, so to that point right there in Seattle is unique
and that, you know, we have a very generous electorate.
We have the ability to do a lot of things and experiment and try things.
But I, I also think that, you know, to
this point that there is this opportunity for real innovation.
I was thinking, what is the problem that I have constantly tried
and just trying to solve?
Any of us are trying to solve, trees versus housing issues.
So this talk about actually help us.
All right.
Deliberate, joke there. And,
you know, so, so how might we use AI on that?
I mean, I definitely think that the, the big overall plan
is you need more flexibility for development and prioritizing
saving trees over all the other things that we put on development,
sound advice, etc.
but one of the things we really need to understand is data.
You know what are the most important trees in the city?
So people talk about the last 6000, where are they?
What kind of locks are they on?
And then what would it take to have, you know, how many lives
could we develop if we were able to have a degree of flexibility that saves trees?
And I think that would be a great application of AI.
And you know, maybe I'll get to
that after we figured out how to pressure wash Capitol Hill three times a day to.
So that's something.
But again, just to like point out around how to be proactive.
And I just want to name check something because
Doug Hurley and Jared are in the up in that in the house tonight.
One of my favorite policymaking areas of, you know, Washington state
history is the early 90s, when we created the Future Production
Act, Regional Transit Authority and the Growth Management Act.
And those are all things that we made up, you know, that
that policymakers in our community actually made up in response to problems.
And, and I think you can do that, you know, so I think if we can all
figure out how to get the time, those of us on the front lines.
But that's where the community comes in, too, right?
Which is how are we creating that next generation
of innovative policies that solve the problem of the day?
And that is really, you know, part of why I think, charge to all of us is,
you know, Trump has us talking about some things,
but let's all focus on the things that we care about and invent those things
that will move the ball forward in the way we think it needs to go forward.
And that's the power that we have at the local level.
Thank you.
That's great.
- Do you have any thoughts about the process?
- You know, I, I it's hard to top it that, that that was that
that left me feeling very hopeful.
I think it might be an opportunity for the,
for a massive civics lesson for people that don't really,
appreciate the distinction between local and federal.
And, and I think this is an opportunity for local government to shine
and see inside of the chaos swirling around up here.
The busses are still running, the toilets are still flushing.
You know, we can still we can still go through with our daily lives.
And and we have a unique opportunity in this region with the sanctuary laws.
Frankly, I know even back when I was sheriff,
I would go into various communities with a lot of undocumented immigrants and
and say, we are not going to ask you these questions.
Well, how do we know the law says we can't do it
so that there are things that we can we can emphasize
the positive side of the fact that we are a sanctuary state.
I know that's the right term,
but there are things that we can talk about that makes us unique
in this area, this region of the country, this this part of the state.
So, you know, focusing on those positive things, I think is really important.
- I think let me underscore a couple things here.
This is a special region, but it's been it's felt more special
and sometimes than it does and others, than it has in others.
But, but let me remind everyone, Metro
won lots of awards in the 70s and 80s.
All that, creative work around, that sort of the nexus of climate
and environmental policy that Jessyn talked about.
We were a model there for a while.
Okay.
The Seattle police were like the first place to have a lot of, like, cops.
And this is like going back a long time.
But my point here is that these are also institutions and policy areas
where we've all been wringing our hands, going, you know, at various times
in the last 10 or 15 years, going, what do we do about
X agency or less in such policy area?
We have had windows in our retail industry,
where we have been at the forefront of some very cool stuff.
So let's get there.
And is what I'm hearing all right.
Is that Mr. Chair?
- Hi. I so,
I actually believe that there are cases
as represented where government works.
Kind of, you know, kind of out
of retirement place now.
And so I watch social media and,
you know, the radio as well.
I sure don't hear
and I keep talking to some of my local representatives
and I say, you know, you guys are if you are next door,
there's a lot of people who have all the answers on how, you know,
and maybe somebody who jobs could start communicating.
The genius
of our president is that he is extraordinarily
good communicator, probably the best communicator we've had,
maybe with the exception of Flint, but certainly not the most,
to, right.
We need to find ways
to communicate with government.
Those two things, like we need to know how to show the government those things.
Right.
And that's how you're going to start to build a trust.
The trust is not going to come until people see success and hear it,
and they are not doing it now.
- So the question
I think to group them to that raises is are there considerable
or are there strategies or tactics that, those of us who care about public service
can use to communicate really vividly and powerfully?
The value of government and, and some of some of the, some of the cool stuff
it can do, some of the valuable public good, valuable stuff.
- So this is a really good one where I, I don't know that government
is actually the right venue for being the amazing communicator.
In the sense that, you know, Trump is,
an effective communicator in the sense that he takes up the tension.
But to do that, he busts open a lot of norms that I think
we care a lot about here in terms of the truth, telling the truth.
And so we have very strict rules about
what is campaigning, what is not taking care of that here.
So, so I really appreciated that point.
And I think we're always constantly figuring out now
how do we show Off the waterfront, which is really extraordinary, right.
And what's happening?
But I also wonder if that is a role where, you know, engaged citizens
and community members, you know, can, can, can partner and tell a story.
And I'm thinking about to use another example from the past around and
I can't remember the name of the nonprofit that was set up to promote,
Seattle trade. What was that?
Something probably not in this group.
But it was a nonprofit that was set up to work with the port,
with the ports, with the city, to promote trade.
Right.
In a way that city government or maybe the ports couldn't do
without having that kind of outside group, to be able to promote.
So I would just encourage us to think about how, you know,
this is a place where maybe the best role is actually for community members to be,
you know, trolling next door and talking about how awesome the waterfront,
for example.
Is. Yeah.
- To us, given Seattle's
status as a sanctuary city,
can you speculate on what a police chief or a sheriff might be telling
commanders and officers
on the street about how to interact with federal officers
who they resist, who they support?
- So the point if can I repeat the question?
I think that's a great question.
So so the question is what what what would a, police command staff
or a chief or a sheriff, communicate to their, their officers and,
and their commanders about, how to react
if they were face to face with, federal law enforcement agents
who were,
At risk of breaking the law, trying to break the law,
trying to contradict or contravene our values. Yes.
- Oh, that's the fundamental question that is being played
before this group that I'm part of out of Georgetown.
What do we tell our leaders and commanders to do?
What that Ice agent is, is doing something that we believe violates Constitution.
And I'm not going to speculate and say what I think the Seattle chief
or the Tacoma Chamber, I you know, I don't I don't know yet where we are.
I do know that we have we have state law on our side right now
in terms of what information we ask for, with information we release.
But the way things are going that it's just and and I think that's
what everybody is afraid of is that when we no longer
I mean, we it's the rule of law is right now.
And I don't know how a police department functions when a rule of law,
begins to collapse.
And that's what you're describing, is when there is a fundamental breakdown
between what the Constitution says we can do
and then what a central agent says we can do.
So I don't have an answer for you get
thus far,
the laws that we have have been effective,
and I don't know where we're going to be in six months.
Not a great answer. Sorry.
- We have time for 1 or 2 questions or two more questions.
- Yeah, I just I, I just want to follow up with that as citizens
or as a social worker, what can I do
if and when I shows up in my neighborhood.
And so my daughter's in Boston and they just raided communities there.
And so she went to her professor saying,
if I see an, police car with ice on it,
am I allowed to protect my classmates?
So what will happen in Seattle?
I don't expect you to know the answer,
but you're in Wallingford, the Central District, as a citizen.
And how do we respond?
- So the question question is, are there things that citizens can do, in particular
social workers or faculty members or others
who have some sort of institutional standard or responsibility
for, communities or neighbors
who who may be at risk of, of a nice,
raid or something like that?
- Again, I'm, I'm getting ahead of my skis here.
Yeah. Physical resistance.
I would never recommend that because you're not going to win that fight.
But I do think you don't.
There's nothing that compels you to cooperate.
And and so I think that's probably
the most rational thing to do right now is, is, is if you feel like
what's happening is unconstitutional, it is not legal.
I certainly don't provide assistance.
And I think that's where local law enforcement can be very effective.
I, I, I at least like to think that our local law enforcement
has a good enough relation ship with schools, with medical facilities
and those sorts of, local institutions that that if there was a question,
they would call 911 and say, hey, I mean, this this happened a few times
when I was still the interim chief.
We get a call from from the principal.
Hey, there's a couple of big guys with ice.
If they thought they were Ice agents, I don't know how they were marked.
So. So, you know, calling the local police,
I think is still a good option, but this is just such unchartered territory.
And, I just you just I, I hate to say.
Yeah, to do this and then. The end of the enterprise.
- And I have I have other stories from the university also.
- So you should know that. Yeah, I think all institutions are asking.
So one resource that the city of Seattle has is if you go to the Office
of Immigrant and Refugee Affairs web page, there's a whole list of guidance
for what people can do in a variety of circumstance.
And so I encourage everyone to go look at that.
There are trainings there, articles there, you know,
a whole a whole set of different of different resources.
So that's a really good place to start.
And then you can kind of think about your own individual circumstance.
And you know, at the city of Seattle, we have protocols for our employees
and how to, you know, bring that up through the chain of command,
how we communicate about it.
But I do think for just residents, that's probably
going to be their best resource in their whole variety of circumstances.
That's what you can look at and see if that's useful.
- But I would say based on what the University of Washington has done,
we have a policy.
We have recommendations for faculty about, you know, how
you can protect your classroom, call university security immediately.
If there's no response, you pull in one.
Here's what you say.
Here are the things you can say to anybody who tries
to the classroom without authorization, can't find any.
So the lesson I take from this is look to the institutions
that you trust or represent or live from here.
If you are a leader or, or a member of a resistance,
even if it's just a neighborhood group, talk about this stuff and figure out
what are we going to do, what is our policy?
What are we going to recommend to each other?
Last question.
And then we're going to wrap up I. Hi.
- I keep thinking about these
kind of friends that come together around like,
and you were talking about a room where there's two days and there.
So you're talking about political polarization and like.
And there's questions here around trust and what do we do?
And that question, like,
what are we supposed to do?
Feels like the question at the bottom of that.
And I'm wondering like, other than,
you know, what's the government called it?
Which, you know, that day, the big,
like, and then I think about polarization and I think about loneliness,
and I talked about the internet
and I and all of these forces that are coming together to ask us
to do something deeply inhuman, which is to be separated from each other.
And I'm wondering if, like, bring it all back together
to, like you've expressed what you think the government should do.
What do you think is important for the citizenry
to do other than to come to the next whatever?
- So this topic comes in from the Black Table executive.
This is, you know, I recognize, you know, through the light.
Thanks, Alex.
Question to the panel is what can the citizens or the citizenry do,
- start talking to each other, build relationships
across that divide, talk about the fact, if we're being bombarded
from social media, trying to
to break us apart, trying to pit us against each other,
and I think the more you have to intentionally try to build relationships.
I live in a, in a unique neighborhood where I know all my neighbors.
I know their kids, I know the grandkids.
But we are the exception
that if everybody really made an effort to get to know each other,
to start building relationships, it's like the little Lego pieces
you just keep building and building and you start to meet people
that are part of that group that I'm supposed to hate.
I really think you start at the relationship level.
- Yeah.
I mean, I think this is a great example of that.
What came into my head was, that is the the committees of correspondence
and the Revolutionary War era. Right.
Or in the old days, people writing letters to each other to stay connected.
But, you know, this kind of creating this space.
And then here for creating a space so that we could have this conversation tonight.
I think that is absolutely where it starts being in dialog together,
building relationships together, and then picking problems to solve together.
I really think that's important as well with, you know, those trusted people.
And then you, you know, kind of you're an organizer.
You know how this works.
You know, I think this, this kind of convening is really the nucleus,
you know, that big kind of policy innovation
change that we can control here.
And that is what I think.
And in doing so, we also build our own kind of muscles around resilience.
It has we are navigating this really, really terrible things
that are happening in our country.
- Congress. Last word.
- Well, though, I mean, the only thing I'll add is that,
I'm a big believer in celebrating wins where you can find them
and building and building strong creative momentum behind that.
So those, those wins in such a demoralizing environment
are often hard to come by sometimes. So when we have them
and when we find them, we have to find ways to celebrate them.
And to your point about loneliness, and I do think
a lot of people feel isolated, helpless, demoralized.
Right.
So how how do we how do we take
dialog, communication, community and movement towards action
to celebrate some very localized wins that we can put on the board?
Because I think that's what's going to build some energy and momentum.
I mean, our side
needs to celebrate some wins, and I think that's what we need to find.
And then hold on to those.
And then then also for those that are feeling
alone and demoralized and isolated, to not feel alone, demoralized
and isolated is really important, actually build a team around this work.
So and so, you know, it's easier said than done.
But I think those those are probably the necessary ingredients for us to,
to be able to, to figure out how we uplift community in spite of all
these headwinds.
- Please join me in thanking our panel.